Israelis are by and large human beings. Palestinians, exempting the 20% that do not support the tactics of Hamas, are savage barbarians.
It is time for human beings to triumph over the savages.
For those wondering why I have chosen to devalue the lives of people, it is because they have devalued their own lives. Any culture that endorses and promotes suicide bombings has violated the requirement necessary to be a member of the human species. The human culture is a culture that values human life.
80% of Palestinians have decided for whatever inexcusable and insufficient reason that human life does not matter. Therefore, those 80% no longer matter. They can be discarded as an afterthought the same way that one throws out an empty pizza box.
The 20% of Palestinians that do actually value life, love their families, and want peace may be innocent victims. Yet not an ounce of sympathy should be given for the 80% that have chosen to devolve below the Homo Sapien creation.
For those that want to understand what the conflict in the Gaza Strip between Israel and their genocidal enemies is really about, several brilliant columns have been written lately.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/01/israels_proportionate_response.html
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/01/a_real_ceasefire_needed_in_gaz.html
Yet the Rosa Brooks award for anti-Israel bigotry belongs this week to Aaron David Miller of Newsweek.
In keeping with the policy of the Tygrrrr Express, I do not link to garbage. Go to a search engine and do research, which is apparently more than Newsweek does.
Below are some gems from an article entitled “If Obama is serious, he should get tough with Israel.”
“First, whatever the transgressions of the Palestinians (and there are many, including terror, violence and incitement), he’ll also have to deal with Israel’s behavior on the ground.”
Transgressions? Committing adultery is a transgression. Stealing from the cookie jar is a transgression. The word to describe the Palestinians behavior towards the Jews of Israel is M-U-R-D-E-R. Murder is not a peccadillo. It is one of the 10 Commandments. The Commandment does not say “Thou shalt not kill.” It says, “Thou shalt not murder.”
Israel’s behavior on the ground results in killing. There is not one example of murder. With the Palestinians, it is virtually all murder.
This is why words such as “proportionate,” “balanced,” and “equal,” are dead wrong in describing this conflict. The behaviors are not equal. Therefore the solutions must be biased, unbalanced, disproportionate, and completely unequal.
“Then there’s the settlements issue. In 25 years of working on this issue for six secretaries of state, I can’t recall one meeting where we had a serious discussion with an Israeli prime minister about the damage that settlement activity—including land confiscation, bypass roads and housing demolitions—does to the peacemaking process.”
There are no “occupied” territories. There are DISPUTED territories. Israel owns the land that it won in the 1967 War. They are building houses on their own land. This bothers some squatters whose only claim is that they try to steal it and reproduce like bunny rabbits, if bunnies were genocidal.
The Road Map stated that the Palestinians had to stop terror before anything else took place. The Palestinians never did this. Therefore, there is no agreement in place to violate. Israel even pulled out of Gaza, and the Palestinians then used Gaza as a launching pad for more terror.
Some criticize Israel for suspending humanitarian aid. There is no humanitarian aid. Moneys delivered over the years have been used to purchase weapons. This is why the Palestinians are the most armed and least well fed people in the Middle East.
As for demolishing houses, Israel for some naive reason actually warns civilians to leave their homes before any invasion. They start out by dropping leaflets warning of the incursions. What other civilization in the middle of a war warns the other side of attacks. Israel goes out of its way to reduce civilian casualties.
I hate this policy because it does not work. Israel needs to learn that it will never get an ounce of good will from much of the world. Palestinians murder Jews, and Israelis demolish empty houses. Talk about a disproportionate response.
“But Obama should make it clear that America will not lend its auspices to a peacemaking process in which the actions of either side willfully undermine the chances of an agreement America is trying to broker. No process at all would be better than a dishonest one that hurts America’s credibility.”
Even left wing anti-Israel writers accidentally get something right from time to time. This is known as “Blinking VCR Theory.” No process would be better than a dishonest one. So let’s have no process. There is not a single process that will make the Palestinians stop being lying, cheating, murdering maniacs. What will stop them is overwhelming brute military force.
The left does not understand that the reason processes they recommend fail is because bad people lie and cheat until conditions force them to be honorable.
“Our willingness to go along with Ehud Barak’s make-or-break strategy at the Camp David summit proved very costly where more disciplined critical thinking on our part might have helped preempt the catastrophe that followed.”
It was not Ehud Barak’s plan. It was Bill Clinton forcing Ehud Barak to give away the entire store, and Yassir Arafat refusing to take it. Disciplined critical thinking? Where was this writer educated, a Poison Ivy Tower League University? This is a war, not a term paper. Does anybody think that Bill Clinton or Yassir Arafat would be involved in anything involving discipline?
“Giving Israel a veto over American negotiating tactics and positions, particularly when it comes to bridging gaps between the two sides, is quite another.”
Ah yes, the “Jews control the world” argument. This Mr. Miller may be the love child of Pat Buchanan and Tony McPeak. Buchanan referred to Congress as “Israeli Occupied Territory,” while McPeak blamed U.S. foreign policy on Jews in New York and Miami.
For the intellectually deficient left wing media (redundant, I know), allow yourself to drink a diet drink called Crystallization Light. Jewish values are human values. Hamas values are four legged animal values. These are not equal.
It is time for Israel to get tough, and for left wing America to stop supporting murderous terrorist savages in the name of equality.
eric
“There are no “occupied” territories. “There are DISPUTED territories. Israel owns the land that it won in the 1967 War. They are building houses on their own land. This bothers some squatters whose only claim is that they try to steal it and reproduce like bunny rabbits, if bunnies were genocidal.”
If Israel owned the land then they should claim it as their’s. You’re making a bogus argument here. Israel won’t claim the land because they don’t want it as part of their national territory (yet), because then the Palestinians would become a real competitive political bloc in the Parliament. If Israel is to be a democracy, and they “owned” the West Bank and Gaza, then Israel would have to accept another 4 million Palestinians into the body politic. Oddly enough, 3 out of 4 Israeli Arabs say they would rather live in Israel than anywhere else in the world. Citizenship for all the people’s of the Occupied Territories, would probably go a long way toward ending the violence. It would also bring to an end the problem of settlements, as the question would then be moot. But no, Israel does NOT own the Occupied Territories because it claims NO ownership. Israel is complicit in maintaining the status quo, and so shares that part of the blame for this endless violence.
JMJ
Jersey.
Whatever rendition of ownership or settlement you would like to provide does not change the fact that Israel is going to stop the force launching bombs at it no matter what the status of the land under the launching pad is.
If Israel can get that 80% that are enabling terrorits or terrorists themselves to die or leave then the “bloc in the parliamet” would not be so viable. Leaving them only about 800,000 to worry about.
That 20% would probably be mostly innocent women and children whos indoctrination of hate may not be too thick yet to be able to cure.
Israel is only complicit in not kickin a$$ soon enough.
First things first.
JMJ it is a fact that Israel does not condone the rogue settlements built in Gaza or the other territory that is considered to belong to the Palestinians. Not too long ago they forcefully removed Jews from those settlements to try to make peace and show that they were curbing the actions of citizens. What did the Palestinians do? They burned the buildings down instead of using them.
If you look back before Arafat started his two year old like tantrum you’ll see that the Palestinians lived quite well next to Israel, even profited from them. Israel has no plans to claim the land and you can’t blame all of Israel for the actions of the settlers who are a minority. Even a society like Israel has its fringe group.
Web Reconnaissance for 01/05/2009…
A short recon of whats out there that might draw your attention, updated throughout the day…so check back often….
YJM – http://yourjewishmaster.blogspot.com/2009/01/my-take-on-israel-short-and-sweet.html
Bishop, that scene doesnt feel like it was that long ago either.
And some of them house were damn nice too !
Burning them down was no worse than tossing a water fountain just because a black man drank from it.
But if course liberals will get all lit up over racism and bigotry in America, care more about Africans that are being attacked by radical Muslims but could care less when its the Jews that are being attacked and discriminated against in the same way.
And then theres this cease fire crap I keep hearing.
Cease fire, cease fire !
If I hear cease fire one more time I’m gonna shoot someone.
Everyone and his brother around the planet is calling for a cease fire.
Countries that arent even a part of this conflict, the UN, Condi is talking and E V E R Y B O D Y is trying to work something out when for once I would like to see a war get fought from beginning to end without a bunch of budinskies sticking their nose in the middle.
So we get a case fire ? For what ? Everyone knows its just time for the enemy to regroup, but are will those Israeli soldiers and people of died for nothing ?
I hope to God this gets fought til the end
I second Mickey’s comment in it’s entirity! We know that Hamas only uses cease fires to regroup. They have no intention of making peace with Israel, not now or ever! Those who are hollering for diplomacy in this matter make me want to slap some sense into their idiotic heads.
Good post, Eric.
Micky,
“If Israel can get that 80% that are enabling terrorits…”
I can’t imagine it’s 80%. I’d have to see some proof to believe that.
Bishop,
“JMJ it is a fact that Israel does not condone the rogue settlements built in Gaza or the other territory that is considered to belong to the Palestinians.”
That’s a “fact,” huh? C’mon, get real. Just because they say</em they don’t condone it, doesn’t mean they actually do not. Israel could easily put the kabash on the kibbutzers. They don’t, and so therefore they implicitly support the settlers. Just look at Gaza. When Israel really wants to do sometthing, they do it. They obviously really do not want to remove the WB settlers.
“What did the Palestinians do? They burned the buildings down instead of using them.”
On rare occasion, that has happened. The vast majority of the time, the Israelis bulldoze them before anyone can move in.
“If you look back before Arafat started his two year old like tantrum you’ll see that the Palestinians lived quite well next to Israel, even profited from them.”
I think you get your news from an alternate universe. Arafat did not come out of a vacuum. He is not a comic book villian and this situation is not a comic book story. The Palestinians have been suffering more and more ever since 1947, and Israel is a part of that (along with all the neighboring Arab states).
“Israel has no plans to claim the land and you can’t blame all of Israel for the actions of the settlers who are a minority. Even a society like Israel has its fringe group.”
I do blame Israel for that. They could easily stop the settlers.
JMJ
[…] Melanie Phillips Debbie Schlussel Tygrrrr Express Michelle Malkin […]
According to this if its 60% then Israel has 1,600,000 to deal with.
Thats still significantly less than ALL of them.
http://www.spiritoftruth.org/palestinianelection.htm
Given these exit poll results intially reported after the Palestinian elections, the world was indeed shocked to find out the actual election results were that Hamas reportedly won 60 percent of the vote rather than 35 percent or 39.5 percent as predicted by the exit polls such that the militant organization won 76 legislative seats to Fatah’s 43 rather than Fatah winning 58 to 63 seats versus 53 to 58 seats for Hamas as forecast.
And as a matter of fact Jersey the buildings that were left were burned down on national news casts where Palestninians were quoted as calling them unfit, pig pens what ever.
Thats why I said “some of them house were damn nice too !”
And even if the houses were bulldozed the temples left were burned.
— Tom Gross;
” at the behest of the Palestinian Authority, destroyed the settlements, leaving only the synagogues, which it was hoped the Palestinians would respect. On September 12, 2005, the last Israeli soldier left Gaza, and it took just 15 minutes for the first abandoned synagogue to be set alight.”
Jersey, Arafats tantrum got him locked up in his own home for two years and there was absolutly no reason or excuse in the world for you to come out swinging with your traditionally childish “comic book universe” rants that really are not condusive at all to what Bishop said.
The only people that are responsible for Palestinians suffereing since 47 iis the Palestinians.
Each peace agreeement they broke made it harder for them by their own doing.
JMJ;
“I do blame Israel for that. They could easily stop the settlers.
Good, then you have to blame every adult Palestinian for enabling or not taking the responsibilty to oust Hamas after discovering that they are just pawns.
If you were subjected to Hamas in your home what would you do ?
Enable them, not do anything ?
Not doing anything is enabling
Those who have done nothing are as guilty as those who voted for or work hand in with them.
And when they did deal with the settlers what kind of thanks did they get ?
(BOMBS)
Anyway.
I dont see how any of that post somehow justifies anything the Palestinians are doing.
I don’t care about evacuated temples. I don;t even know why they left them. Kinda insulting, if you ask me. I mean, if it was a bunch of empty mosques being abandoned to a bunch of angry Christians, I’m sure those Christians would do the same thing.
I don’t care what Tom Gross says anyone who thinks Arafat started all this doesn’t have a clue about history or how real life works.
Remember, Palestinians did not commit the holocaust, they did not drive the Jewish refugees from Europe, they did not refuse the Jewish refugees entry into their country before 1948, and they did not come after WWII to their country to live. In the end, when all is said and done, the Palestinians have always just been more victims in all this, even if they haven’t been very gracious in defeat.
JMJ
January 4, 2009
The Weedpatch Gazette
All pretensions aside the basic problem is that Jews, a “stiff-necked people” as God called them, are generally not liked. Jews are no more liked today than they have ever historically been. Others will do business with them but they may not like them, and not all the Jewish Hollywood propaganda in the world like The Ten Commandments, Ben Hur, Fiddler on the Roof and Exodus aggrandizing Jews has changed the historical record that in general people do not like Jews.
The Football of the world they have been kicked from here to there, from nation to nation throughout history because they refuse to assimilate and bow to other cultures and their gods, maintaining a religion and traditions that are odious to other nations and peoples that has brought them into conflict wherever they have tried to establish themselves. But it is to their own hurt all too often wherever Jews have taken control they have abused their advantage of wealth, a weapon Hitler used quite effectively, and in Hollywood and TV where by bullying influence every relative will find a place of employment irrespective the lack of talent and the unspoken words “Christians and Gentiles need not apply” too much like the old “No coloreds allowed” are too often the case.
But the historical record from the Bible has it God intentionally chose Abraham, Ishmael was the bastard cast out and never to usurp Isaac as the rightful heir (resulting in the hatred for Jews on the part of Muslims we see today) and eventually the tribe of Judah became predominate from all the others because they alone remained stedfast up to the time of the Babylonian captivity. But all that followed led to the form of Judaism into which Jesus was born represented by rabbis and the Torah. Then following the capture of Jerusalem and destruction of the Temple by the Romans the Diaspora resulted in the dispersion of Jews throughout foreign lands. However, the ideal of a future restored nation of Israel and Temple remained the hope of Jews, and while Hitler unwittingly provided for the launching of the modern nation of Israel the restoration of the Temple and instituting all the proper sacrifices yet remains a future hope.
I used to know a chess champion who once told me he never beat an opponent that didn’t have some excuse for losing like “he wasn’t feeling well and on top of his game,” much like Judd Hirsch staring at the board after losing a game and exclaiming to Jeff Goldblum “This is not checkmate!” Some people simply cannot admit to losing. They “know” they are better and smarter than their opponent so how is it possible they can lose?
When it comes to religion it’s a matter of “my god is the real thing so you are an infidel and I’m better and smarter than you! Therefore it isn’t possible for me to lose to you!” And if it were not for all the hatreds and bloodletting resulting from this it would be seen for the silly thing it is. But the terrorists of whatever stripe remains bullies using the same theme of their god is the real thing, and that excuses every heinous crime against humanity no matter what!
Satan is the ultimate sore loser. Through his supreme ego he thought he could rise above God and overcome the Most High. But God checkmated Satan, and the Bible is a reliable source for discovering how Satan despite his having lost is determined to make things as miserable for humankind as he can. Satan is still screaming “This is not checkmate!” despite the truth of the matter as outlined in the Bible.
There is no such thing as a “proportional response” to the monsters that prey on women and children, those that rape, torture and murder women and children to satisfy the monstrous lust that drives such creatures of the Devil. You either kill them or put them in prison for the rest of their miserable lives. But is it any less such a monster that is going to murder others, men, women, and children in the name of their peculiar deities?
Those speaking for Israel understand there is no such thing as a “proportional response” to terrorists. Like the rattlesnakes they are, killing them is the only proportional response. And if it means those supporting the terrorists are in the way they should never have supported the terrorists to begin with.
Since the rest of the world excepting America is against Israel, the Jews may now be attempting to call attention to this fact in the hope that the present action being taken may polarize nations and expose the actual anti-Semitism that prevails among so many nations against Israel. No other nation would be expected to endure the indiscriminate lobbing of rockets by terrorists against civilian targets so why is Israel expected to endure such a thing? Now Israel is forcing a decision on the part of other nations; are they going to confront the hatred of Muslim terrorists and the nations that countenance and even encourage it for what it is or are they going to continue to scapegoat Israel?
As for any help from Barack Hussein Obama, I think Israel can discount anything like that. No matter what he says the man is not to be trusted and will do what he believes to be in his own interest and Israel be damned! I believe the Israelis understand this and it may well be the reason for their timing in meeting the problem head on now. But to my detractors I will say in all honesty I hope I am wrong.
From a Biblical perspective this may be the beginning of the End of the Age, it may result in the nations gathering themselves together to wage war against Israel. But my understanding of that eventuality is that America will not be a key factor in this. One possibility of this coming to pass would be the economic collapse of America removing us from being of any help to Israel.
It is all intensely interesting to me both as speculation and from watching events unfold in real time in the real world. I’m in the enviable position of being a spectator rather than having to participate physically. In other words no one is shooting at me, the bombs and rockets are not falling here in the Kern River Valley, and having nothing to lose I’m free to speak my mind. Nothing heroic about that, but there is still the responsibility of people who are free to do so to speak their minds while they still can. The time to be heroes may yet come for us right here in America, even here in the Kern River Valley.
And there is no getting past the promise God made to Abraham, God’s promise there would always be a remnant of those who like Abraham would remain faithful to God, and would be the inheritors of the promise no matter how the nations of the world might seek to destroy them. But it is to that remnant of true believers, the legitimate children of God that the promise of God’s blessing belongs not the pretenders.
Samuel D. G. Heath, Ph. D.
That was nuts.
JMJ
Those were good nuts (most of em) and not squirrel nuts.
It was approached from many different aspects that outlined the justifiction for Israels actions.
” I don;t even know why they left them. Kinda insulting, if you ask me.”
I couldnt burn my temple, or church. I get it.
“I’m sure those Christians would do the same thing.”
Not really, the suggestion of leaving then is the hope that you will use it and that the offering was made.
“I don’t care what Tom Gross says anyone who thinks Arafat started all this doesn’t have a clue about history or how real life works.”
Who cares if you care what he thinks or not ?
Those are the facts.
The epitomy of ignorance is to think that you know how life works for anyone besides yourself.
Thats communist when you assume life works the same for everyone, or that someone can tell us.
Would that be you ?
Are you going to be the great diciple of true virtue for all of us ?
Pffft.
“Remember, Palestinians did not commit the holocaust,”
No, but they have said they would like to re enact it and so has their supporters , IRAN
“they did not drive the Jewish refugees from Europe”,
they did not refuse the Jewish refugees entry into their country before 1948,”
Yea, right after the agreement was agreed upon.
Besides that, you guys have much faith in the UN and bilateral agreements how come when it comes to the Jews you dont care so much what the UN and bi lateral agreements stand for ?
and they did not come after WWII to their country to live.”
Israelis are there legally.
“In the end, when all is said and done, the Palestinians have always just been more victims in all this,”
They are their own worst enemy that need s a cultural enema.
“even if they haven’t been very gracious in defeat. ”
Not being gracious in defeat means to walk away without shaking hands.
They are a bunch of chickensh*t punk murderers
No, Micky, that was just plain nuts.
I think that guy has a PHD in Biblical Lunacy.
It is not a “fact” that Arafat started anything. That’s just comic book silliness. You guys and your silly, childish comic book super villian and super heros and people who act in a vacuum of only good and evil and all that insipid nonsense. In the real world, things happen for real reasons, there are real histories, real interests, real motivations. Not God, not good and evil, not comic book silliness.
JMJ
JMJ, Wow!! “In the real world, things happen for real reasons, there are real histories, real interests, real motivations. Not God, not good and evil, not comic book silliness.”…
Can a comic book create itself? Does it not require an author, editor, and someone to color, staple and organize pages? Talk about comic book silliness…if a comic book can’t just happen, how could something as intricate as an earthworm or a bird just happen? Evolution? Ha!! Where are the half fish, half mammal skeletons… Yes, there are real histories and real reasons, and real motivations…and they are ALL about good and evil…and a designer. yes, Satan has dominion over the earth…”the real world”, as you put it, and we have real hope because of the designer, not because of the Arafats, Hitlers, FDRs, or PEOs of the world. (No, I am not putting FDR or PEO in the “evil” category – I’m placing good and bad in the same category: human… and human = fallibility)
.
The delusional insanity of the Left is frightening. They ignore all facts and logic. Hamas, a terrorist organization killing the so-called Palestinians’ hope for peace’, are evil garbage, they must be eliminated. They have sent thousands, yes thousands of missiles into Israel over the past couple of years and Israel had never exercised their right of self-defense, until recently, when Hamas broke the ceasefire and started firing rockets again.
Israel is FINALLY doing the right thing. If Hamas is destroyed, then, if the rest of the ‘Palestinians’ really want peace they can give up their dream of destroying Israel, if not, they will never have peace.
Israel must destroy as much of Hamas as possible before the MSM and the idiots and ignorants whine loud enough for them to stop. They must only quit when they are ready.
For EVERY missile shot into Israel at least ONE missile should be returned to the area as close as possible to the shooter. Tit for tat. Every single missile should be returned. Period. Treat them like adults, if they kill, they will be killed. If they send missiles, they will receive them. That is the only way they will learn. Screw public opinion, force them to see the truth, or let them be damned.
.
absurd thought –
God of the Universe says
hope your kids grow up
to strap bombs on babies
to kill other children
.
absurd thought –
God of the Universe says
form a terrorist country
then wish to be destroyed
by committing acts of war
.
absurd thought –
God of the Universe says
blame your failings on the Jews
for a few more thousand years
they are Earth’s scapegoats
.
absurd thought –
God of the Universe says
give Israel away
to appease her enemies
dishonor America
.
absurd thought –
God of the Universe says
never mock Democrats
it’s just their religion
you RIGHT-WING INFIDEL
.
All real freedom starts with freedom of speech. Without freedom of speech there can be no real freedom.
.
http://libertarian.to
.
http://haltterrorism.com
.
http://lulu.com/USpace
:)
.
Jersey, what you failed to get out of that post was that it was depicting the many different reasons one could have to justify Israelis defending themselves.
I didn’t see the man shoving any one opinion down our throats, or claim any one thing to be the definite reason.
He said “perspective
and “may be ”
Did you miss the part where he said;
“From a Biblical “”perspective”” this may be the beginning of the End of the Age”
You could justify it from a religious perspective, a historical perspective or a rational perspective with no religious factors being involved.
And if you seriously believe that there is no good or evil and that things just “happen” then its no wonder you’ve got so many bridges you’re trying to sell.
Would you like to try and convince people that Hitler was not evil ?
Tell me why some people, no matter how much positive influence in their life still are as bad as they come ?
Genetics ? Bad diet ? Organic/psych illness ? Satan?
No matter who or what you believe is behind our existence you have to agree that these people are just plain ole “BAD”
Of course knowing that you have incredible contempt for religion it doesn’t surprise me that you would launch a halfass attack like that on someone just for bringing the subject up without really bothering to look in depth at what he was saying.
I must say.
Its you living in an imaginary world if you think that there is always something that justifies the actions of people who are basically just rotten little A holes.
Liberals, democrats, whatever are never able to draw that line in the sand making clear as to what is right and wrong, good are bad.
This is why wars go on forever, murderers and other criminals are coddled by you and you always manage to find some lame excuse for bad behavior.
“It is not a “fact” that Arafat started anything.”
He never started anything ?
Remember when President Clinton, Arafat and Ehud Barak went to Camp David and Israel offered the creation of a Palestinian state over 90 percent of the West Bank ? And when Arafat rejected the offer and insisted all Palestinians be allowed to go back to Israel instead ?
That’s right, that idiot actually was trying to convince everyone that the two could live side by side in harmony, no problems.
LMAO, yea right ! You don’t think he was just trying to get as many Palestinians in there as possible so he could kill anyone there who was not Palestinian ? What better way to create an influx than to say its all for peaceful measures ?
“ARAFAT” started the breakdown of negotiations and did start the “Second Intifada,” which is still happening as we speak and is only to be carried out for the Palestinians by a different army (Hamas)
Here’s a “FACTUAL” list of things that Arafat did start.
” he was powerfully influenced by Haj Amin el-Husseini, the Islamic mufti of Jerusalem who was closely aligned with Hitler and schemed from Berlin to import the Fuhrer’s genocidal program to Palestine.”
I’ve been driving the connection between radical Islam and Nazis and this is just one more example. Its also one reason why “Mein Kampf” sells so well down there.
“In the late 1950’s, he co-founded Fatah, the “Movement for the National Liberation of Palestine.”
“1969, Arafat was the chairman of the Palestine Liberation Organization, the umbrella group he never ceased to dominate after merging Fatah into it a year earlier. The PLO had a single purpose: the destruction of Israel.”
Hell, they were even over here bombing stuff, remember Jersey ?
Or were you still in diapers ?
So please, you can stick your head in the sand and scream all you want that Arafat didn’t start anything but cold hard historical facts just make you look like….
You’re wrong
Eric,
I too am a staunch supporter of Israel in this conflict! However, I don’t agree with you that the rest of the world has finally come around to the support of Israel. Israel’s actions are being protested all over the world and here in DC there are protests at nearly every embassy.
I once took formal schooling from an Imam (out of curiosity) and I know of what I speak! Only death will end the Muslim desire to eliminate Israel (and the U.S. among others) form the face of the earth.
If you beat them (Muslims) badly enough, they will craw back in to their caves, lick their wounds and start building again toward their goals.
According to U.S. intelligence, Hamas has fired more than 6000 missiles into Israel since the last “Peace Agreement”! No one in the media, here or abroad, seems to care about that!
At this point in time, I think that the Bush administration has it about right.
The big question is will Obama support Israel in the future? I fear not. It appears that he and his advisors actually believe that if the U.S. stops supporting Israel, that the Muslims will stop hating us.
Nothing could be further from the truth! Islamic leaders will see such action as a weakness and we will be hit with a 9/11, after 9/11 after—–
Watch Dog
Really Jersey.
As you go on on life I suggest you store in your mind that believing there is no God, no higher power, is just as looney as you would say those are who believe in a maker.
Until one side or the other can prove that there is or is not a God I suggest you stop demeaning those you dont agree with.
Having faith in nothing is the same as having faith in something you cant prove.
So it really serves no purpose but to make those who talk down about the other than for them look like idiots.
Can I blame you for thinking we are just “here” ? Not really.
No more than you can blame me or anyone else for thinking that there is some divine inspiration behind everything.
I myself think that those who do not choose to entertain the concept of a creator are of a lazy mindset that would rather just make it simple to fall into an intellectual comfort zone by casting out the possibility that we are not alone.
It doesnt take much to just say; “well, here we are, and thats that”
It takes an awful lot more to try and figure out just why we are here, whats the purpose and what are the rules if there are any.
I realixe I may be contradicting myself a little considering what I said above but noytice that I am not saying anyone is stupid , or promoting “lunacy”
I am just saying that they dont want to take the time to think and give the benefit of the doubt that they could be wrong.
If I’m wrong what have I lost ?
What if you’re wrong ?
The difference is that I dont believe as a charade for expedient purpose .
I do have many questions and doubts about Gods purpose and intention.
But I never doubted the existence of something more than just plain existence.
And so I will spend the rest of my life trying to measure up to what I believe the purpose of my existence is.
Watch dog.
I think what Eric meant to portray was that the usual suspects who always bash Israel at times like this are singing a different tune this time.
And the thing with the media is driving me batsh*t nuts also.
For ever 10 minutes of showing wounded and dead Palestinians they give us about 1 minute of what Israel has suffered.
This morning on CNN I watched a clip for ten minutes showing crying Palestinian babies, people running down the street, people complaining about no water, no food, no power and not one of them blaming Hamas for being the ones responsible for diverting aid from Israel that gets traded for weapons and cash.
Theye even showed two Palestinian girls about 5 years old each being slid into the same reefer compartment in a morgue with the sheet down and their bloody faces exposed. They did the same thing with a couple other corpses.
Finally, after about 10 minutes of drilling our eyes with this scenario they mentioned the 6000 bombs the Palestinians had launched and then moved to another topic.
And we wonder why there are people out there that are bashing the Israelis ?
Eagle,
“Can a comic book create itself? Does it not require an author, editor, and someone to color, staple and organize pages?”
You’re not following my metaphor. In comic books you have simplistic scenarios, with good guys who act purely out of goodness, and bad guys who act purely out of badness. Yes, there are plots, but they are ridiculous contrivances.
“Talk about comic book silliness…if a comic book can’t just happen, how could something as intricate as an earthworm or a bird just happen? Evolution? Ha!!”
Well, to follow your metaphor here, all I have to say is that anyone who doesn’t believe in evolution has a very weak grasp on reality. You’re setting mankind back hundreds of years.
“Where are the half fish, half mammal skeletons…”
This is a joke, right?
“Yes, there are real histories and real reasons, and real motivations…and they are ALL about good and evil…and a designer.”
No. There is no designer. There is no good and evil. There are reasons for everything. What to you is evil, to others is good. Good and Evil are just subjective measurements. They are not real, tangible things. There’s crazy, yes, but even crazy has it’s reasons.
Did you know the average number of religions per country is 32? One, Papua, New Guinea, has well over 600. Much like comic books, people have been thinking up religions for time immemorium. What makes you think that your religion, of the countless thousands there have been, is the right one? What if one of those Papuans know something you don’t? Comic books and religion have another thing in common – super heros and super villians who act out in an arbtrary universe created by a writer or writers for the purpose of telling a story, perhaps with a moral or two.
If you base your world view on religion, then yes, you are living in a comic book universe. You may as well just make up all your reality as you go along.
Micky, I did not make any effort to criticize what Israel is doing now. I understand it. I hope it ends soon, and for everyone’s sake that the blood loss be kept to a minimum. But I have not attempted to argue what Israel is doing is right or wrong. I only tried to put all this into a realistic context.
JMJ
“I did not make any effort to criticize what Israel is doing now. I understand it. ”
Thats a lie.
Realistic for you is no more tangible than what you said about good and evil.
Cuts both ways buddy
Jersey, micro evolution is common sense – as certain species are exposed to different elements, they adjust, evolve slightly, but their dna doesn’t change. Macro evolution – apes to humans – or fish to mammals – or anything of one type species to another type species – or one cell “thingies” to two celled “thingies” has never, ever been proven. Scientists have tried and tried, but they can find no link…no half fish/half mammal, no bird with one wing and one fin… so rather than starting at the beginning, they decided to start at the end – the link between ape and man…The Nebraska man was designed from one tooth by a creative scientist, only to learn later it was the tooth of an extinct pig. The Piltdown man was a deliberate hoax, and the Java man was a combination of man and gibbon. The Peking man was a mix of animals and humans, and the Neanderthal man suffered dietary deficiencies, and Lucy couldn’t have been the missing link because man walked upright before her time… Each species was created by a designer. You don’t have to call him “God”. I do not have a religion, so I cannot say whether one religion is right , wrong, or indifferent. I am a highly logical person, therefore, I have faith that if an inanimate building needed a designer, then all the intricate living species also needed a designer. This is my faith. Humans are fallible, so they bastardized religions by making human interpretations and human rules. I call my designer God, and I am both honored and humbled to have this interaction – it wouldn’t happen in many places of the world, to include many homes and towns near me.
I do agree with some of your arguments, though – I don’t believe most people are necessarily all good or all evil – there’s a mix of both in everyone. However, some people allow the evil within them to be acted upon, just as some people allow the good within them to be acted upon…and there’s a balance that allows civilization to exist.
Yet I have to argue Jersey.
I actually havent read a comic book in decades but I do remember charcters that were constantly torn between good and evil. So it kind blows your metaphor if you’re going to generalize all comic book characters as either good or evil when many of the plots and stories involved those characters battling with their conscience as to whether or not their decisions were right or wrong.
Superman, Batman, The Hulk were also iften depicted as public and urban enemies.
Alot of these books are no different than much of the how the liberal media portrays our public officials or especially Bush. The print media hardly ever gives him a break and depicts him as an evil horn headed demon much like the picture of him that you photoshopped for your blog.
The only difference is that they have cool pics where certain parts of the anatomy are usually exagerated.
Also whether you want to argue evolution or creation theres still the argument that evolution os a process created by God. Which I firmly believe.
I and not too many people out there take the bible in such literal context that they actually believe the earth is only 4000 years old.
Gimme a break.
Nor do we believe that it literally took only 6 days to make the earth when science makes it undoubtedly clear thru carbon dating that it infact took much longer.
The bottom line is that of you choose to believe that we are all just accidents of science I suspect that its just a lazy mind that goes there because its easier to swallow, requires less reasoning and complex thought, and terribly convenient when you have no moral authority to answer to and you may as well just make up all your reality as you go along.
You have also made your own reality by convincing yourself with no proof that there is no higher power.
So, with that in mind, you can get down of your high horse of superior intellect because when it comes right down to it, thru your own admission, you’re not much different, smarter, or better than anyone else.
Eagle,
“Micro” and “Macro” are just subjective measurements. They are not real, tangible things. To an ant you are huge, to a whale you are tiny. There is no such things in scientific jargon as “micro” or “macro” evolution. They are irrelevent terms. “Evolution” is just another word for “change over time,” nothing less, nothing more. It is not micro or macro, jsut change over time. All things that move, by definition, change. They change position relative to everything around them and sometimes they alter or are altered by their movement or the movement of other things around them. This happens on every scale, regardless of what you subjectively coin “micro” or “macro.” This whole “micro/macro” thing is an invention of the ID movement and has no scientific merit.
Another ID invention without scientific merit is the false assumption that somehow evolution confers the “changing of one species into another.” Evolution confers no such thing. Species do not change into other species. What can happen, however, is that individuals can mutate, pass their mutations along, and eventually, gradually over generations, a new species emerges. “Species” is just a term for a group of individuals who are genetically similar to a certain extent, as with genus, phylum, etc. A species does not evolve in and of itself. A species may die out, a new species may emerge, but species do not en masse become other species. The odds of that happening would be phenomenal.
Another false assumption the IDers make is that somehow there is no evidence of “links” – of intermediary types. But that is not true. The evidence is found in the Earth in the form of fossils, and all amongst us in the form of other types that have varying degrees of similarities. Given that the evolution of types stems from individuals there is an overlap of intermediary species. So we can plainly see, in the case of man, that our closet relatives are the great apes (chimps, bonobos), down to Lemurs and such, down to lesser mammals and so forth. It’s not that we are directly descended from these specific species, but rather we are all descedents of ceratin common individuals on down the family tree.
As for Good and Evil, they are just more subjective measurements. What to one person is good to another may be evil. We are all animals on a big spinning rock in space. We are all products of our environment, our evolution. We are motivated by our interests and the interests of those with whom we connect. The basic laws of physics apply to everyone and everything. There is a reason for everything that happens, from what we think and do, to why we think and do it.
If you need to believe there’s a designer for all this, then fine. Whatever floats your boat. It is a useless assumption. It doesn’t matter. You can’t base anything on it. You can’t assume anything from it. It just makes you feel important, like you’re more than just another little thing in the great big universe. But when you use this pointless assumption to stand in the way of progress, then you’re nothing more than just another loony religious nut making the world a worse place for all of us. A slightly more progressive Taliban.
Micky, yeah, yeah, I like comic books too, and yes the stories and characters are often more filled-out then I described. But they’re still fictional representations for the consumption of adolescents and children. They are not real life.
“The bottom line is that of you choose to believe that we are all just accidents of science”
And here guys is another fallacy in your logic – there is no such a thing as an “accident of science.” Science is just the study of things. The only accidents are made by scientists when they do something wrong, or trip over a bunsen burner, etc. We are not “accidents of science.” We simply are. We exist. It was not an “accident,” just an occurance.
As for your little attack, it is not I who needs to feel superior or more important in the universe. I am in awe of things just the way they are.
JMJ
“As for Good and Evil, they are just more subjective measurements.”
Like Gerbil warming.
Science can be “IN” action also.
Evolutionary progress is a result of science being applied whether it be intentional or accidental.
“We simply are.”
Once again. This is the lazy mind that wants to enter no challenging thought.
Accidents are occurances. Unintended.
” am in awe of things just the way they are.”
Thats easy to do when you “simply are”
I am in awe of much more than you could relate to since you choose to demean and simplify the existance and purpose of man.
If youy say “there is no purpose” then you have defeated any reason for our existance no matter what your beliefs.
““As for Good and Evil, they are just more subjective measurements.”
Subjective only out of convenience.
Having a moral authorty takes away the subjectivness and defines it so that there is a standard.
But of course once you do not commit to that authority there is all the reason in the world for one to be able to justify any act as one mans evil is another mans good.
Having this you get to make up the rules as you go along and justify what is usually not good for those around you, but pleases you.
“whos to say “?
Thats the motto of the left.
Abortion, underage sex, promiscuity, lack of commitment to a standard.
The bottom line is this.
If you’re not willing to believe that theres more than we can explain and believe that everything works just a little too well, and makes too much sense, you’re just a lazy mind or fearful of what you might find.
As far as the comic book thing goes. Lets out it this way.
I actually tire of movies where the good guy always wins.
In real life sometimes the bad guy wins.
We as a society dont want to see this, liberals make most of these movies and are the ones under the belief that we can all just get along one day.
Well guess what ? As much as the bad guy wins sometimes , so does the good guy. But we are under the false belief that its always done by virtue of some set of morals that dictate we must be of some purity the bad guy does not posses. Well, we can kill and be bloody but its the reasons that make it matter. And the definition of good and evil that comes from that moral authority is what defines if the purpose is worthy.
Liberals keep thinking they are the matchmakers of the world and in the end just keep trying to mix oil with water.
Now, who lives in a comic book universe where the impression is forever kumbaya ?
Let people draw the lines in the sand and we’ll all do much better.
There are ethics,there are morals, there are borders, there is right and wrong, evil and good.
And when we fail to make them a reality and justify or excuse them by saying they are subjective we are a race destined for failure.
JMJ, the accusations, from the very beginning, are a true sign of weakness. The very first time I posted, you wrote that you were going to bury me. Several months later, you accuse me of being a progressive Taliban because of my “religion”… “faith” and “religion” are two entirely separate entities. But, since I have faith, I am a wannabe of importance, therefore I must be really stupid and can’t grasp what former Pres Clinton explained so eloquently in his definition of “is”… now I get it. It’s a liberal thing that I wouldn’t understand…as Micky pointed out… abortion, welfare, murder…
Micky,
““As for Good and Evil, they are just more subjective measurements.”
Like Gerbil warming.”
No. Global Warming is a theory based on objective measurements. Good and Evil are subjective measurements made by people, based upon their morality, to judge the behavior of other people. The morays from which these judgements are based are set by other people, usually a long time ago, based upon a combination of their whims, social standards, and the interests of power.
“Science can be “IN” action also.
Evolutionary progress is a result of science being applied whether it be intentional or accidental”
No. Science is simply the study of things. It is not a thing unto itself. Science is only “in action” when someone uses the scientific method to study something. Evolution is not a product of science. It is a scientific theory.
““We simply are.”
Once again. This is the lazy mind that wants to enter no challenging thought.
Accidents are occurances. Unintended.”
Your insult aside, whether you believe in a creator or not, “we simply are” holds true. If you do believe in a creator, then you are content that we are because a creator made us so and that’s that. If you do not believe in a creator then “we simply are” begs much further questioning.
That questioning interests me and I do question. I am in awe of the fact that there are so many questions yet to be answered. If you believe in a creator, then the questions are already answered and you would be content without want to know more.
“If youy say “there is no purpose” then you have defeated any reason for our existance no matter what your beliefs.”
Again, “we simply are,” to a nonbeliever such as myself, begs much further inquiry of the universe and how we came to be in it. The “reason” or “purpose” for our existence becomes a question yet to be answered, and finding that answer becomes the great drive for greater scientific progress.
“As far as the comic book thing goes. Lets out it this way.
I actually tire of movies where the good guy always wins.
In real life sometimes the bad guy wins.
We as a society dont want to see this, liberals make most of these movies and are the ones under the belief that we can all just get along one day.”
Interesting point. But hey, most movies are made to be escapes from reality. We want the good guys to win because in real life so often they do not.
“Let people draw the lines in the sand and we’ll all do much better.”
Another interesting point. And while we’re at it, let’s not cross those lines, lest we become yet another failed empire.
Eagle,
You certainly don’t have to be a liberal to be atheistic, antitheistic, or agnostic. Just go visit the folks over at Reason. There are lots of conservative and libertarian (tons of libertarian) non-believers. And I don’t think you are stupid at all. You, like everyone else, are simply a product of your evolution and environment. You may be a genius for all I know. You are who you are. I simply disagree with you about some things and think that people who think like you sometimes hold back some of the social, scientific and intellectual progress we humans so desparately need.
JMJ
[…] in Israel certainly have a different interest in these unceasing skirmishes. My online buddy, Eric has written that he sees the Palestinians animal-like. I think if Eric would perhaps set aside his obvious bias- […]
Global warming is subjected to interpretation.
Period.
This is why its being debunked day after day. Most recently since its been discovered that the models the OPCC and the UN have been using are bull. The computers its been discovered do not ahve sufficient data to predict what we’ve all been hearing.
What data there is has been “SUBJECTED” to opions and agendas.
There is no predictive value in the current generation of computer GCMs and therefore the alarmist IPCC statements about human-caused global warming are a bunch of crap
“Another interesting point. And while we’re at it, let’s not cross those lines, lest we become yet another failed empire.”
Germany, Japan and radical Islam crossed the line.
The first two failed as we defeated them and so will radical islam. It may be tougher because thet are no geographical constraints, but hey, we’ve always found a way.
“Science is only “in action” when someone uses the scientific method to study something. Evolution is not a product of science. It is a scientific theory. ”
When it rains on a hot street and you see steam you have science in action without mans production, study or action.
The science of reaction to action is in play.
Bottom line is this.
You can play all the pedantic semantic word games that you want.
But, if you’re wrong, you’re going to be in a lot more trouble than if I’m wrong.
I missed this one.
“Your insult aside, whether you believe in a creator or not, “we simply are” holds true.”
No, then the word “simply” does not apply any more as there is complexity involved when you bring another factor into the picture. That factor being the creator.
” If you do believe in a creator, then you are content that we are because a creator made us so and that’s that.”
Not at all.
The objective is to adhere to the teachings of the diety and his son and to make sure that each generation improves upon these teachings to the point that each generation is a little more enlightened than we were 4000 years ago.
The progression of man in all areas is due to the strive to perfect ones self. And as time goes on and those perfections are handed down compiled against all the other hand me downs from the human race as a consequence comes closer to excellence with each generation.
If we lose that sight we cease to grow morally, ethically, spiritually and intelectually.
” If you do not believe in a creator then “we simply are” begs much further questioning.”
Nope. because even if you figure out how we got here or the process it still does not answer the question as to who or what was behind the creation and what the purpose of/reason for our creation was.
This is why I have a hard time with Armageddon or the end times or the rapture.
Why would God place us here and let us only obtain a fraction of our potential as people and then just yank us away from it all one day.
I think we will be here for quite sometime until weve perfected ourselves to a point where hes happy with what weve become.
We’ll either blow ourselves up or make something even greater out of what we see and what we are before any judgement is made.
We will of succeeded in identifying the exact differences between good and evil. Once evil is identified in its exactness we can rid ourselves of it without eliminating any part of good by accident.
Everything around us just fits too well, makes too much sense and worked out so perfectly that its almost impossible to imagine there not being something intelligent behind it.
I did not choose to believe “first” because I was told so about anything as most people are indoctrinated into believing out of fear.
They are raised and told that if you dont believe you’ll go to hell.
I chose to believe on my own out of sheer amazement and wonder.
Which is why I say that if you are wrong the price you’ll pay will be bad.
If I am wrong and you are right the worst that will happen to me is what you say.
That which would happen according to you, would be nothing.