At the 2008 Republican Convention in Minnesota, I had the pleasure of meeting John Stossel.
http://abcnews.go.com/2020/Stossel/
http://townhall.com/columnists/JohnStossel/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stossel
For those who do not know, John Stossel is one of the few voices of reason in a world gone mad.
” When we hear that the U.S. Treasury is doing this or the Federal Reserve is doing that, we should remember that these agencies are run by mere mortals, and as such, they cannot know how to “fix” something as complex as an economy. But they certainly are capable of wrecking one.
That’s what their inflationary policies will do.”
Those words are from his most recent column a couple of days ago. He also has more to say.
“Without prices, economic coordination is impossible, which is why attempts at state planning produce, in Ludwig von Mises’s words, ‘planned chaos.'”
His subsequent comments get to the heart of the current financial mess we are in.
How can the economy straighten itself out if it is being systematically skewed by government inference with prices?
“We are in the mess we’re in precisely because of earlier government interference. Easy mortgage terms and guarantees contrived a housing boom and irresponsible lending that could not be sustained. The consequences have shaken the foundation of the financial industry. But instead of freeing the market and allowing the errors to be corrected, the government is seducing the economy into a whole new set of errors. That will lead to the next bust.”
Yet it is his conclusion that should be mandatory reading for every individual in America. I personally have been saying that anti-market hysteria is what causes normally rational people to hysterically shriek that we must “do something.”
No. We do not have to “do something.” It it is ironic that the same people who refuse to “do something” about killing terrorists, are so obsessed with doing something that they cannot successfully fix. This is important because the anti-market left is willing to watch the world literally burn without any plan to save it. Yet they will not let companies that destroyed themselves burn. In other words, these people only want to do things when it would be counterproductive, and want to leave well enough alone when intervening is right.
“‘But doesn’t the government have to act?’ people ask. ‘We can’t just let financial companies fail!’
I say, Why not?”
Can I get an Amen? Preach on Brother Stossel!
He then goes on to cite one of the most brilliant investors of all time, a man I have met personally and interviewed, commodity genius Jim Rogers.
“Jim Rogers, the successful investor and author, puts it well: ‘Why are we bailing out Citibank? Why are 300 million Americans having to pay for Citibank’s mistakes? The way the system is supposed to work [is this]: People fail. And then the competent people take over the assets from the failed people, and then you start again with a new stronger base. What we’re doing this time is … taking the assets from the competent people, giving them to the incompetent people, and saying, ‘OK, now you can compete with the competent people.’ So everybody’s weakened: The whole nation is weakened, the whole economy is weakened. That’s not the way it’s supposed to work.'”
I have stated over and over again that I am a rah rah cheerleader for corporate America. I believe in corporate America, and I believe that a great CEO should be allowed to have their multi-million dollar salaries, private jets, and other excesses. Every industry has a percentage of crooks, and most CEOs are good stewards of their businesses that earned their luxuries.
Yet my deep love of capitalism requires that I stay consistent and demand that failed CEOs be ruthlessly punished.
This is why Detroit should drop dead. The Big 3 automakers deserve nothing but slaps in the face. Let them all go bankrupt. Let the airlines go bankrupt.
Let everything burn.
The reason for this is exactly as Mr. Rogers and Mr. Stossel understand. With the stock market crashing, people are bargain hunting. On Black Friday, the shopping malls were filled with people looking for discounts.
What could be a better investment for a competent and successful executive than an entire company at rock bottom prices?
JP Morgan bought Bear Stearns and Washington Mutual because JP Morgan believes that these companies have potential to be moneymakers for them. JP Morgan will do what government will not have the guts to do: Fire everybody that needs to go and start over.
Corporations slash and burn. They become lean and mean. Governments become bloated bureaucracies. Try firing a civil servant. Yet when the corporate carnage is done, the corporation can then expand, and hire workers to do actual work.
This has worked as long as government has avoided meddling.
John Stossel understands this, and my only regret in interviewing him is that the interview occurred just before the financial meltdown. The interview had a “happy” feel to it because he is a fun guy with an enjoyable sense of humor. The interview would not be so lighthearted today, but then again nothing in business is static. With that, below is my interview with the dynamic John Stossel.
1) What issues are most important to you personally?
JS: “Limited Government, Limited Government, and Limited Government.”
2) Who are your political heroes?
JS: “Frederick Hayek and Milton Friedman.”
3) Congress wants to pass a windfall profits tax on oil companies. Should we have a windfall profits tax on Congress for anything they make over $1?
JS: “No. That is harsh.”
4) How would you like to be remembered 100 years from now? What would you want people to say about John Stossel the person?
JS: “I want to be remembered as an awesome beach volleyball player.”
He actually found my comment about taxing windfall Congressional profits to be funny, but he is so committed to limited Government, that he would not even tax Congress. That is commitment.
The thing about John Stossel is that what he learned from Milton Friedman is the closest thing to a truism that currently exists. The current economic conditions do not invalidate the message.
The job of a government is to cut taxes and kill terrorists. It is not to be a social worker. It is not to determine winners and losers, or institute “fairness.” The reason for this is simple. Every time government tries to do this, it fails.
John Stossel wants to be remembered as a great beach volleyball player. If I may overanalyze and perhaps misinterpret his comments, he simply wants to be left alone to live his life.
It was a true joy meeting John Stossel, and I hope he gets his wishes in his personal life and in the financial sphere.
I hope that our Government gets the heck out of the way, and lets the market recover. It will recover if we leave it alone. The only thing that is frightening the markets right now are the prescriptions and solutions that will compound the problem.
I wish for true limited government to return to our political prescriptions, so that John Stossel and I can both relax without having to save people from the do harmers in do gooders clothing.
eric
Excellent post. I am a big fan of John’s and his views… it’s so refreshing to have someone like him in the media. With any luck, we can all relax and practice our beach volleyball skills someday.
It it is ironic that the same people who refuse to “do something” about killing terrorists, are so obsessed with doing something that they cannot successfully fix. This is important because the anti-market left is willing to watch the world literally burn without any plan to save it. Yet they will not let companies that destroyed themselves burn. In other words, these people only want to do things when it would be counterproductive, and want to leave well enough alone when intervening is right. ”
Thank you.
When an alcoholics life is crumbling around him and he needs funds to continue his same path of failure the thing that works best is to deny him the funds and anything unless he can produce it for himself.
Let him go unbathed, homeless, hungry and sick from withdrawls until he realizes that everything hes been doing is wrong and admits that all the old methods(Lying, cover ups, fudging moral and financial books, cheating, stealing) and thinking that have been running(destroying) his life need to eliminated.
His foundation needs to be torn down, he needs to see just what a failure he is and how he got there. He needs to be stripped to an empty shell.
Once that is accomplished he needs to be made to see all the good that was and is present in him and that these are the things his foundation should be built on from that point on. We build the addict back up on a foundation of positives and not old habits or deviant thinking.
Any bail out of failure is the same as a person buying booze for the alcoholic who is failing and will only prolong the inevitable or without a doubt make recovery that much more difficult down the road.
These companies, the big three, whatever, are drunk on business practices that have produced nothing but failure and bloated views of themselves to themselves and the outside world.
They need to be cut off and be allowed to take their course that is a result of their own actions.
You cannot reckognize your failure if you dont actually have to see the results of it.
This is what wakes up the alcoholic to the damage his ways have done.
These companies need to see just how much damage they have done.
Without witnessing that reality, without actually having to face the horror, they will never develope the will to try and make sure it never happens again.
Bail outs will just keep them oblivious in their dream world that everything is O.K.
These companies are sick on themselves, and they need to fail. Or we will see more of what we’ve been seeing.
As a guest speaker at hundreds of AA meetings I’ve said;
“Hi ! My name is alcoholic, and Micky is my problem.
These companies have nothing to blame but themselves.
“We are in the mess we’re in precisely because of earlier government interference. Easy mortgage terms and guarantees contrived a housing boom and irresponsible lending that could not be sustained. The consequences have shaken the foundation of the financial industry. But instead of freeing the market and allowing the errors to be corrected, the government is seducing the economy into a whole new set of errors. That will lead to the next bust.”
Stossel lets his libertarianism get the bast of his logic sometimes. How the #$@! did “government interference” create “easy mortgage terms.” And who says the terms were “easy?” The terms were convoluted – not “easy.” Sure, they seemed “easy” to uneducated borrowers hopeful and desperate to live the American dream, but really they were scam vehicles designed to write paper, take the profits, and run, leaving securities contract holders with the fallout. Nowhere in any government program did it allow for writing bad paper. It simply encourage secodary market lending backed by F&F, and that only makes for about 20% of the bad paper. While I understand to Stossel’s fear that bail-outs of this sort of industry can create moral hazard, I also understand that if the bail-outs include accountability and regulations that avert further bad paper writing, the industry can both be saved and put on the right path toward future stability.
Capitalism only works with rules and accountability.
JMJ
Jersey.
Give it up please.
There is no doubt in the mind of anyone with half a brain that government intervention is what caused this.
“How the #$@! did “government interference” create “easy mortgage terms. And who says the terms were “easy?” The terms were convoluted – not “easy.”
Please, its the convulution that made it easy for those who could not afford these houses move into them.
“I also understand that if the bail-outs include accountability and regulations that avert further bad paper writing, the industry can both be saved and put on the right path toward future stability.”
“Capitalism only works with rules and accountability.”
Then it ceases to be capitalism and becomes subjected to government intervention.
Then what you have is socialism/communism
And please, dont go the route with unethical or immoral business practices. There are already laws in place to prosicute those guilty of such.
“There is no doubt in the mind of anyone with half a brain that government intervention is what caused this.”
Are you sane? What? Anyone? Have you read anything whatsoever about this? Have you made any effort whatsoever to actually learn about this? What? Do you get all your thoughts on a direct brain-link from Fox News?
http://useconomy.about.com/od/criticalssues/tp/Subprime-Mortgage-Crisis-Cause.htm
Here’s a little list of factors.
And you can’t possibly have functional cpaitalism without rules and accountability. That’s anarchy. Are you an anarchist, Micky? Should I expect to see you out marching against the government with a big “A” on your torn, armless shirt shouting, “Down with everything!”? Get real. Of course there have to be rules and regulations! What good is a contract if there’s nothing to back it up? What good is money if you don’t know if it’s even worth anything? What good is a product to someone if they don’t even know what it does? Are you for real? You’re talking like a spoiled, thirteen year old whire suburban punk who just read Atlas Shrugged and think you’ve just figured out the universe from it!
JMJ
First of all, I’ve written better papers in my sleep than the link you supplied which looks as if a 17 year old white suburbanite punk wrote it.
Its about one of the most uninformative and vague resources i’ve ever seen.
You seem to think that reading that will somehow make anyone more informed than a spoiled, thirteen year old white suburban punk who just read Atlas Shrugged and thinks he just figured out the universe from it!
It doesnt even begin to explain how the housing bubble it mentions even got started. Or who was responsable for instituting the sub prime rates by leaning on the banks.
Its a hunky dory little rag for simpletons.
a spoiled, thirteen year old whire suburban punk who just read Atlas Shrugged and think you’ve just figured out the universe from it!
Jersey, not only am I sane, but unlike you, I have a memory. Something you could stand to use.
I just explained to you yesterday and also a month ago.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2127214/posts
“The crashed economy via the CRA was started by Carter, strengthened by Clinton and re-formulated by the 2005 Congress. Chicago figures in the beginning stages of this act.
In the 1970s, activists in Chicago and across the country brought strong pressure on banks to lend equitably to all those in their communities. Since its passage, the CRA has been used across the United States to win tens of billions of dollars in new lending, investments, and services for communities. The National Community Reinvestment Coalition tracks more than $1 trillion dollars in community reinvestment pledges nationally. These pledges are explicit investments in equitable development goals, and finance many tools in this toolkit. ”
The above is one example of how government intervention got us where were at.
Its the third time I’ve shown you this real and accurate account.
Of course, I deal in the truth and facts, you depend on opinions and being verbally autocratic so we may never agree on anything.
Once again you’re trying to be slippery and are making a case that is mute as I said myself that There are already laws in place to prosicute those guilty of unethical or immoral business practices.
What your talking aout are contracts where the third party is the government.
The government should only step in when that agreement is reniged on or violated.
How does anything you are spewing figure into my tax dollars having to fund a failing business ?????
Please tell me, I would love to know.
Micky, the link I showed you was just a list of various causes. If you want the opinion of prominent economists…
Here’s Krugman: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/21/opinion/21krugman.html?ex=1355893200&en=12d85102f1690b64&ei=5124&partner=permalink&exprod=permalink
Barry Ritholtz on Jeffrey Brown:
http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2008/12/bush-administration-ignored-mortgage-meltdown-warnings/
Stan Leibowitz: http://www.independent.org/pdf/policy_reports/2008-10-03-trainwreck.pdf (this is a must-read)
The Hudson Institute on the Bind Rating issue: http://www.hudson.org/files/publications/mason_rosner.ppt
There are dozens more out these if you bothered to look. So either you were fibbing or just imagining things when you said, “There is no doubt in the mind of anyone with half a brain that government intervention is what caused this.” The ONLY people who believe that are intransigent laizzez faire ideologues who can never be man enough to ever admit they’re ever wrong about anything.
And the fact that the likes of Carter and Clinton were complicit in this laizzez faire disaster says nothing about the the fact that the laizzez faire policies is waht caused the disaster. It just goes to show that neither Cliton nor Carter were all that “liberal.” In fact, both of them were pretty laizzez faire capitalists themselves. And it is the last refuge of scoundrels to act as apologetics of their ostensible rivals when these “rivals” act as they would.
And what “pressure”? Can you site one sinlge solitary example of this “pressure?” Can you? You can’t. It didn’t happen. There was no pressure whatsoever to write bad paper. It’s a racist lie. Period. But again, it is another refuge of scoundrels to blame the weakest amongst us for the misdeeds of the most powerful.
JMJ
PAUL KRUGMAN !!!
FROM THE NYTs ????
Man, hes the biggest liberal liar on earth !!
If thats where you’re going to point me to its obvious where you head is at, and I’ll bet it smells really bad !!!
Dont ever ever insult my intelligence again by refering me to that cringinging little chicken poo poo moonbat.
Like I’ve said before, it doesnt make you look too bright to think I’m that stupid.
KRUGMAN ????
ROTFLMAO.
“Can you site one sinlge solitary example of this “pressure?”
Here ya go, now sit down and be quite
ACORN, Obama, and the BANKING MELTDOWN
The origins of the Banking Mess can be found in the Community Reinvestment Act. The bill was meant to encourage banks to make loans to minorities living in unstable neighborhoods. Based on that bill and subsequent amendments ACORN was able to intimidate banks into lower mortgage standards paved the way for the meltdown. Last week, ACORN was holding protests, trying to get a cut of the financial-market-rescue bill and only through a grass-roots outrage was this avoided.
Senator Barack Obama was one of ACORN’s Lawyers, he also trained people to “community organize” which in ACORN’s case means pushing banks into making ill-advised loans and fraudulently putting people on the voting rolls.
As he [Obama] rose to a leadership role at Chicago’s Woods Fund, he became the most powerful voice on the foundation’s board for supporting ACORN and other community organizers. In 1995, the Woods Fund substantially expanded its funding of community organizers – and Obama chaired the committee that urged and managed the shift. ACORN is a great way to see what drives Senator Obama’s Policy and how he will drive the country to ruin if (God Forbid) he gets elected.
O’S DANGEROUS PALS By STANLEY KURTZ WHAT exactly does a “community organizer” do? Barack Obama’s rise has left many Americans asking themselves that question. Here’s a big part of the answer: Community organizers intimidate banks into making high-risk loans to customers with poor credit.
In the name of fairness to minorities, community organizers occupy private offices, chant inside bank lobbies, and confront executives at their homes – and thereby force financial institutions to direct hundreds of millions of dollars in mortgages to low-credit customers.
In other words, community organizers help to undermine the US economy by pushing the banking system into a sinkhole of bad loans. And Obama has spent years training and funding the organizers who do it.
————————————————————————————
THE seeds of today’s financial meltdown lie in the Community Reinvestment Act – a law passed in 1977 and made riskier by unwise amendments and regulatory rulings in later decades
———————————————————————————–
CRA was meant to encourage banks to make loans to high-risk borrowers, often minorities living in unstable neighborhoods. That has provided an opening to radical groups like ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) to abuse the law by forcing banks to make hundreds of millions of dollars in “subprime” loans to often uncreditworthy poor and minority customers.
————————————————————————————-
Any bank that wants to expand or merge with another has to show it has complied with CRA – and approval can be held up by complaints filed by groups like ACORN.
In fact, intimidation tactics, public charges of racism and threats to use CRA to block business expansion have enabled ACORN to extract hundreds of millions of dollars in loans and contributions from America’s financial institutions.
Banks already overexposed by these shaky loans were pushed still further in the wrong direction when government-sponsored Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac began buying up their bad loans and offering them for sale on world markets.
Fannie and Freddie acted in response to Clinton administration pressure to boost homeownership rates among minorities and the poor. However compassionate the motive, the result of this systematic disregard for normal credit standards has been financial disaster.
ONE key pioneer of ACORN’s subprime-loan shakedown racket was Madeline Talbott – an activist with extensive ties to Barack Obama. She was also in on the ground floor of the disastrous turn in Fannie Mae’s mortgage policies.
Long the director of Chicago ACORN, Talbott is a specialist in “direct action” – organizers’ term for their militant tactics of intimidation and disruption. Perhaps her most famous stunt was leading a group of ACORN protesters breaking into a meeting of the Chicago City Council to push for a “living wage” law, shouting in defiance as she was arrested for mob action and disorderly conduct. But her real legacy may be her drive to push banks into making risky mortgage loans.
In February 1990, Illinois regulators held what was believed to be the first-ever state hearing to consider blocking a thrift merger for lack of compliance with CRA. The challenge was filed by ACORN, led by Talbott. Officials of Bell Federal Savings and Loan Association, her target, complained that ACORN pressure was undermining its ability to meet strict financial requirements it was obligated to uphold and protested being boxed into an “affirmative-action lending policy.” The following years saw Talbott featured in dozens of news stories about pressuring banks into higher-risk minority loans.
IN April 1992, Talbott filed an other precedent-setting com plaint using the “community support requirements” of the 1989 savings-and-loan bailout, this time against Avondale Federal Bank for Savings. Within a month, Chicago ACORN had organized its first “bank fair” at Malcolm X College and found 16 Chicago-area financial institutions willing to participate.
Two months later, aided by ACORN organizer Sandra Maxwell, Talbott announced plans to conduct demonstrations in the lobbies of area banks that refused to attend an ACORN-sponsored national bank “summit” in New York. She insisted that banks show a commitment to minority lending by lowering their standards on downpayments and underwriting – for example, by overlooking bad credit histories.
By September 1992, The Chicago Tribune was describing Talbott’s program as “affirma- tive-action lending” and ACORN was issuing fact sheets bragging about relaxations of credit standards that it had won on behalf of minorities.
And Talbott continued her effort to, as she put it, drag banks “kicking and screaming” into high-risk loans. A September 1993 story in The Chicago Sun-Times presents her as the leader of an initiative in which five area financial institutions (including two of her former targets, now plainly cowed – Bell Federal Savings and Avondale Federal Savings) were “participating in a $55 million national pilot program with affordable-housing group ACORN to make mortgages for low- and moderate-income people with troubled credit histories.”
What made this program different from others, the paper added, was the participation of Fannie Mae – which had agreed to buy up the loans. “If this pilot program works,” crowed Talbott, “it will send a message to the lending community that it’s OK to make these kind of loans.”
Well, the pilot program “worked,” and Fannie Mae’s message that risky loans to minorities were “OK” was sent. The rest is financial-meltdown history.
IT would be tough to find an “on the ground” community organizer more closely tied to the subprime-mortgage fiasco than Madeline Talbott. And no one has been more supportive of Madeline Talbott than Barack Obama.
When Obama was just a budding community organizer in Chicago, Talbott was so impressed that she asked him to train her personal staff.
He returned to Chicago in the early ’90s, just as Talbott was starting her pressure campaign on local banks. Chicago ACORN sought out Obama’s legal services for a “motor voter” case and partnered with him on his 1992 “Project VOTE” registration drive.
In those years, he also conducted leadership-training seminars for ACORN’s up-and-coming organizers. That is, Obama was training the army of ACORN organizers who participated in Madeline Talbott’s drive against Chicago’s banks.
More than that, Obama was funding them. As he rose to a leadership role at Chicago’s Woods Fund, he became the most powerful voice on the foundation’s board for supporting ACORN and other community organizers. In 1995, the Woods Fund substantially expanded its funding of community organizers – and Obama chaired the committee that urged and managed the shift.
That committee’s report on strategies for funding groups like ACORN features all the key names in Obama’s organizer network. The report quotes Talbott more than any other figure; Sandra Maxwell, Talbott’s ACORN ally in the bank battle, was also among the organizers consulted.
MORE, the Obama-supervised Woods Fund report ac knowledges the problem of getting donors and foundations to contribute to radical groups like ACORN – whose confrontational tactics often scare off even liberal donors and foundations.
Indeed, the report brags about pulling the wool over the public’s eye. The Woods Fund’s claim to be “nonideological,” it says, has “enabled the Trustees to make grants to organizations that use confrontational tactics against the business and government ‘establishments’ without undue risk of being criticized for partisanship.”
Hmm. Radicalism disguised by a claim to be postideological. Sound familiar?
The Woods Fund report makes it clear Obama was fully aware of the intimidation tactics used by ACORN’s Madeline Talbott in her pioneering efforts to force banks to suspend their usual credit standards. Yet he supported Talbott in every conceivable way. He trained her personal staff and other aspiring ACORN leaders, he consulted with her extensively, and he arranged a major boost in foundation funding for her efforts.
And, as the leader of another charity, the Chicago Annenberg Challenge, Obama channeled more funding Talbott’s way – ostensibly for education projects but surely supportive of ACORN’s overall efforts.
In return, Talbott proudly announced her support of Obama’s first campaign for state Senate, saying, “We accept and respect him as a kindred spirit, a fellow organizer.”
IN short, to understand the roots of the subprime-mort gage crisis, look to ACORN’s Madeline Talbott. And to see how Talbott was able to work her mischief, look to Barack Obama.
Then you’ll truly know what community organizers do.
————————————————————————————
And here.
http://www.consumersrightsleague.org/UploadedFiles/ACORN_AHC_Report.pdf
And here.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo125.html
But this is discriminatory!, complained the “community organizations.” Thus, if one browses the ACORN web site, one can read of their boasts of having “predatory lending laws” passed in numerous states which outlaw such fees, prohibiting banks from protecting themselves from the added risk involved in making forced loans to “subprime” borrowers.
“Micky, the link I showed you was just a list of various causes. If you want the opinion of prominent economists”
Nope, I dont want opinions, I deal in facts and real accounts.
But hey, we can both put up opinionted links all day long if you want.
Call Carter and Clinton what you want.
Its still an example of govt. intervention gone wrong.
Stop trying to wash the leftist hands responsible for any of this.
It makes you look ignorantly bias as we all know that it took the actions of many to accomplish this meltdown.
However, as true con that must contribute to putting the real face back on conservatives I have to speak out against government intervention.
And what better place to start than with the left who wants to regulate and control everything ?
“intransigent laizzez faire ideologues who can never be man enough to ever admit they’re ever wrong about anything.”
I cant ever remember you admitting to being wrong about anything, so where does that put you ?
In addition, I was looking back on the thread from a couple days ago and found that POBALDY, whom Eric has told me is a liberal, has backed my claims in his stating that those in Obamas cabinet are much a part of the Clinton cabinet that were in part responsible for this mess.
https://tygrrrrexpress.com/2008/12/india-burns-liberals-plan-tea-parties/#comments
Also on the same thread, the last comment coming from Ssohara backs my claim that the Muslims were what I say they were, and not the peaceful victims of rabid christians as you asserted and that their reign of terror was in fact present 1400 years ago.
Ssohara said;
December 3rd, 2008 at 9:37 pm
Quick comment – my parents are from India, and the person who states that the Muslims were peaceful for centuries is ignorant of history. My parents learned a lot more about Asian history than most Americans, and the Muslims have a long history of conquest. It goes back way before the Barbary Pirates…. ”
Go ahead and read the rest Jersey.
You’re wrong again.
“ACORN, Obama, and the BANKING MELTDOWN”
It’s amazing. You cons just know no shame, huh? Amazing.
Micky, that is the stupidest thing I’ve ever read. I can’t imagine what kind of lunatic would write such a thing. I just don’t know what else to say. Stupidest. Thing. Ever.
JMJ
Is that all you’ve got ?
Yea, it fugures, your typical best come back is void of anything to controvert real details. And the best you can come up with, as usual, is to call it stupid , lunatic etc…
A verifiable account of events and occurances that reach to far more reality than your opinons or lame denial.
The people, places, establishments and occurances I put up really happened. And you cant put up anything to prove it didnt, or that its false
You asked and I gave it to you.
As I’ve said before, if this were a court and we had to make our cases you would be the one commited to the looney bin by the judge for even thinking that your tactics prove anything on your behalf other than this delusional belief that you can say something and its automatically true.
Spend a lot of time clicking your heels together ?
Micky, I don’t even know what that post was. It’s sorta like reading a schizophrenic Sean Hannity on acid. I just can’t believe anyone would write it. Acorn? Obama? The Banking Meltdown? I just don’t know what to say. I’m at a complete loss for words. I don’t even know where to begin. I can’t even find enough logic in it to counter it logically or even find a path to logic to follow in the first place. I’m just stunned.
As for what one Indian has to say about all of Islamic history, I’m not even going to bother getting into it.
And I never said Muslims were the “peaceful victims of rabid christians.” Where you got that from is beyond me.
I’m just going to have to leave this alone now, because I really don’t know how to counter that with a rational retort.
JMJ
JMJ;
“And I never said Muslims were the “peaceful victims of rabid christians.” Where you got that from is beyond me.”
O.K.
Fair enough, but you did say this
“While Christian were living like rabid dogs in the woods of Dark Ages Europe, Islamic peoples flourished abd advanced in peace.”
The “advancement in peace” is a flat out LIE !
And the fact is that these supposedly peaceful Muslims were ravaging christian communities that were anything but rabid dogs..
Soooooooooo, everything is till basically the opposite of what you try to pawn off.
As far ACORN goes, you just cant hang with actual accounts that answered your question.
As opposed to the many of my questions you fail to answer simply because you realize any attempt would make you look more ridiculous than you already have.
Deal with the facts and you’ll be a more convincing debator.
One of these days you’ll learn that your opinion, “cuz you say so” calling people looney or stupid just makes you look like an arrogant autocratic delusional fool.
JMJ;
“And what “pressure”? Can you site one sinlge solitary example of this “pressure?” Can you? You can’t. It didn’t happen. ”
This is a lie, it did and has happened, I answered your question once, and here, I’ll amswer it again.
Stanley Kurtz is no nut and neither is anyone writing for the National review.
They have not enjoyed the reputation of lying and promoting mis information such as Krugman and the NYTs has enjoyed.
http://article.nationalreview.com/print/?q=NDZiMjkwMDczZWI5ODdjOWYxZTIzZGIyNzEyMjE0ODI=
“Acorn has burst into a closed city council meeting there. Acorn protestors in Baltimore disrupted a bankers’ dinner and sent four busloads of profanity-screaming protestors against the mayor’s home, terrifying his wife and kids. Even a Baltimore city council member who generally supports Acorn said their intimidation tactics had crossed the line.’
If you or anyone else really thinks that these banks willingly wanted to offer loans at these suicidal rates you probably own quite a few bridges.
EVAN SAYET HAS THEM PEGGED
http://www.heritage.org/press/events/ev030507a.cfm
Great MP3 reveals that EVERYTHING THEY KNOW IS WRONG, and how they ended up that way.